Dont know where #1 Buckshot can be found, but the Speer shot cups and UNIQUE powder currently easy enough to find. That sounds. If all you practice with is the easy comfortable stuff, its not really practice. Notes: primer: CCI 500; case: Speer; NOTE: All loads are maximum. They are low because of swaged bullets. Did you cross post the bullet weight? I carry my M642 extensively, but I only shoot it occasionally because it is a snappy little b!tch with standard loads. accuracy. In a 1909 vintage Smith & Wesson target .38, the 2.7-grain load cut a nearly one-inch cluster, showing that classics go well together. 2, No. Fifty yards of course is the preferred distance. The .38 Special remains very popular for personal protection and Michelle Hamilton shares her thoughts on the top loads for concealed carry, like this 158-grain SWCHP FBI Load, based on her testing. BrianEnos.com I'd rather shoot my .45 then. Testing out some bullseye with 125 berry's bullets.. My other son fired one shot and handed it back. I really enjoy Trail Boss and use it extensively for plain lead and plated bullets. I would say I completely disagree with you on ever even contemplating using a revolver for self defense unless you are a person that has never owned a gun and not likely ever to practice with it. You may end up with one "not" clearing the barrel. in 158 weight berry's bullet 3.8 grains of bullseye with a taper crimp. I think you will find since the .38 special is headspaced on the rim your case length is very important to achieve your best accuracy. Winchester's website has data for W231 and a 125 gr LRNFP, but not plated. Nitpicking is its own reward., I believe the correct spelling is loathe . I get okay accuracy with 4.4 of W-W 231 and 125s, depending on what bullet is used. L6: 1.550 inch = 39.37 mm Barrel Length : 2.0 inch = 50.8 mm Powder : Hodgdon HP38 Predicted data by increasing and decreasing the given charge, incremented in steps of 2.0% of nominal charge. At one time or another, I also owned and shot a M38 Bodyguard (nka the 638), a M37 Chiefs Special (now the 637), a M60 (which is a tad heavier but no more user-friendly), and a couple of others. I can shoot this load at speeds I cant normally reach with .45. (bullseyeforum.net). What overal length of the cartridge? I may have to rethink my plan. Bonus is that dont need magnum Primers for these reloads. JHP, (WC= WadCutter, SWC= Semi-WadCutter, HP= Hollow Point, RN= Round Nose), (JHP= Jacketed Hollow Point and if GC indicated, means Gas Check at bottom of lead bullet). Hollow points are not. 10 for a full cylinder. Bullseye is one of the oldest smokeless pistol powders and still one of the most popular. As I said I am not familiar with your frame and suspect it is one of the latest models out by Smith. The big medicine was delivered by a 1911, but S&W K frames (favorites were Models 12 & 64) took care of everything else. VihtaVuori Oy Company, reloading booklet (1995) Numerous magazine articles on reloading special calibers and personal loads where noted. When you could leave city limits and just about every dirt mound in sight, was a plinking range. Would .44 Special be somewhat similar to .38, in terms of ease of reloading, case life, etc.? Like the author said, I consider it a garbage disposal round as you can load it with almost anything with good results. . Thats what the Cavalry Board asked for over a century ago, and thats what weve got. Wadcutters are tailor made for lightweight snubbie practice, allowing shooters to enjoy shooting the pocket guns. Ammunition is available everywhere handguns are legal. The powder charges used for .38 are forgiving. Ive saved all my .38 brass over the last couple of years for whenever I find time to get into reloading. THAT TIME IS BETTER SPENT LEARNING HOW TO SHOOT THE REVOLVER IN THE RAPID FIRE PORTION. And this is a guy who normally trusted nothing but a 45 acp. June 13, 2016 in 9mm/38 Caliber. RN, 160 gr. They are true classics, and I hope you get as much use out of them! Hornady With all the loads available, you can surely find one within recoil tolerance. Despite being well over one hundred years old, it still has perfect relevance for todays shooters, both novice and advanced. 38 Special Loads for Bullseye by GerhardG Sun Jul 17, 2022 11:01 am Greetings, Looking for load suggestions for 38 special LSWC 158 grain SNS bullets, red coated based on the following powders; Bullseye, Unique, N310 and N320. Through the heyday of bullseye shooting over the various match courses of fire, there was probably a Mount Rushmore-sized mountain of powder loaded and combusted 2.7 grains at a time. My Ruger LCR .357 Magnum is pleasant to shoot even with full pressure loads. Times across steel plate racks and many of my standard drills with the 200-grain SWCs rival my best easy-shooting 9mm results. head I use 3.2gr. With a charge of only 3.1 grains of Winchester 231 powder, velocities run around 750 to 800 fps with good accuracy and mild recoil. But not too tough. We've got some great loads for 158 coated and plated semi wadcutters, and we're trying something new. 4.0 gr. Have a Tritium sight and laser on it to boot. Bullseye Handgun Powders Smokeless pistol powder Billions of rounds have been loaded with Bullseye since it was introduced in 1913. These are the bullets I bought: 158 gr from Roze dist. Josh Wayner is a Michigan native, active competitor, Grand Valley State University alumni, troublemaker, and fiction author. Although the .357 cylinders are the same length so they can be timed to a 642. All right are Reserved Reload Ammo, Reloading The .45 ACP (Automatic Colt Pistol), hi=849 lo=728 ES=122 (powder up and down), hi=821 lo=684 ES=137 (powder up and down), hi=815 lo=637 ES=178 (powder in normal positions), hi=714 lo=549 ES=165 (powder up and down), hi=758 lo=693 ES=65 (powder up and down)(DO NOT USE LESS), Hi=886, Lo=861, ES=25 (This is a Carolina Cast bullet SWC-great cowboy load), hi=859 lo=743 ES=116 *(my personal medium load), hi=875 lo=685 ES=190.2(powder up and down), hi=710 lo=497 ES=213 (powder up and down), hi=791 lo=625 ES=166 (Powder up and down), hi=785 lo=670 ES=115 (powder up and down), hi=801, low=766 ES=35.32 in Contender 14 bbl. The pistol or revolver of good quality is vital. Be careful !!!! For example, a Glock 17 shot the HAP into 1.35 inches and the FMJ into 2.2 inches at 25 yards. This produces about 550-650fps from a 1 7/8 barrel and feels like shooting a very powerful .22LR. Always make sure your lead bullets have been sized and lubricated. (Patrick Sweeney photo) September 15, 2021 By Michelle Hamilton, Field Editor. Some use powders dispersed in liquids, some use electrostatic guns to spray dry powder on their bullets. "Berry's Superior Plated Bullets are the finest bonded copper-jacketed bullets available today.." ?. Start conservative if you wish. Great gun with the best factory double action trigger Ive ever shot. I bought him as a gift a 642 with the black rubber grips, a few speedloaders w/big knob tops, and Hornady 125 grain FTX loads. Classics go well together: circa 1909 S&W .38 Special and traditional 148-grain wadcutter load of 2.7 grains of Bullseye. I bought a Ruger Alaskan in 454 Casull last year ahead of a hunt up in Wyoming. 3 1/2" average not included flyers which seem to happen on every group test. You are spot on about Trail Boss, that stuff is magical with cast reloads. So I expect recoil would be substantial and not very target-ish. He loves this gun and keeps it in reach 24/7. I here from quite a few that 3.5 gr of bullseye is a good load for 158 gr lead Bullets for bullseye shooting. Berry says load plated bullets to mid-range jacketed bullets of same profile and weight or equal to hard cast. I don't know what bullets you have, but Berry's recommends per their website to use hard cast data for their plated bullets. I use CCI Snake shot for two and Buffalo Bore short Barrel 130 gr. I'm new to reloading, starting off with a single stage Lee press reloading .38 special and .357 magnum with Lee's 4 die carbide set. When I finally took the plunge and started handloading (FIRST SHOTS WITH HANDLOADING: How Hard Can It Be? The same volume of BE will weigh much more than than same volume of WST. Caveat: I have decided that I want to be prepared for threat scenarios that include stopping a terrorist or spree-killer (the odds of which I fully recognize is statistically zero). What I have found most remarkable is how well some pistols that typically fling wide groups have clustered the semiwadcutters. Forget about it. Jack it up a notch and go with .327 Federal Magnum. Three in particular proved as good as their longstanding reputations would indicate. It also shows that the loads were established using a 6" barrel, so regardless of what any published data shows, the chances of ever finding published data for the exact projectile and barrel length you are using, as well as the exact conditions you will be shooting in, would be nearly impossible. Only need cast when driving up to 1200 fps or so. My brother put CT laser grips on his wifes M36. I favor the appearance of the C/T load and find it slightly easier to grab and orient in the loading process. Nothing, they dont need any. Were all familiar with the old adage, Never bring a knife to a gunfight. And while we should, The active shooter is a relatively new phenomenon in the grand scheme of things. That little 9 oz. swatmag.com is a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn advertising fees by advertising and linking to Amazon.com. The beauty of shooting a .38 is that you can easily practice at the ranges youd fight at using basically any cheap bullet at minimal expense. I found the plated wadcutters to have NO accuracy. Others Have reported some success but few have more than one or two loads. Load it using wadcutter specs, and seat the bullet flush, like a wadcutter. In my time with the cartridge, I have come to appreciate the mid to low end of the power spectrum and thus have made extensive use of Trail Boss powder and bullets such as Hornadys .358 158gr SWC. These loads are for my wife's revolver. Unsurpassed for .45 ACP target loads. Bullseye is the best powder I have found for 38 special. Jacketed bullets create a bit more wear on the rifling, but its better than trying to wire brush out a bunch of lead build up. Just depends on what kinds of loads you plan to shoot. If I do carry a revolver its my 642 with a laser grip in my right front pocket or my SW model 69 5 shot 44 mag. You will be, essentially, making 38 Short Colt. The Bullseye powder pushed five into two inches flat for another 1911 that is typically a four-inch gun. Dennis, I dont reload and Im only 72, but shooting the .38Spl in my 6 S&W 586 is a sublime experience. I have done it with 38 special and 44 Mag, only to have a lead coated bore that looked like a rusty old drain pipe. The .38 ammo is more common to find than the .44 ammo, so that is a big reason to reload the .44. Anyone know where I can download a chart where all the powders burning rates (regardless of manufacturer) is listed. She ran two cylinders of 100 grain wad cutters and gave it back to me. I cannot begin to fathom shooting 20,000 rounds out of that revolver! I was hoping I could use this combo to make use of available components. I meant to say NRA. It would seem that a 125 grain GDHP is of the same weight and would have a similar profile to what you want to use. Ok, will the bullet easily pass thru the cylinder throat, if so, you need the next larger size bullet dia. I have 4 handguns that will shoot .38. Any hotter and we get into a recoil issue. You are absolutely correct. All newly manufactured .38 Special revolvers must be proof tested to the same higher proof . * Rules say (e) Ammunition- Any safe .38 caliber ammunition using the 158 grain round nose or Semi-Wadcutter bullet only. The key to those rounds, in spite of their paltry muzzle velocity of something like 825 feet per second out of a snubbie, is their diameter and mass: they will make significant diameter holes and penetrate respectably in attackers. Everyone here who has tried plated bullets including myself, have had disappointing results in accuracy. Load it in 38 Special dies. Years back, for indoor matches I teamed the heavier S&W Model 28 with 3.4 grains of the same powder and bullet in . Notes: Bbl Length: 5.6; primer: Fed. 5 are good choices. I wish Id had a commercial version of this load in my ammo allocation when we were tasked with getting classes of students up to special operations standards with the issue custom 1911s. Smith & Wesson Model 27 .357 Magnum (because no 6-inch Smith & Wesson .38 Special revolver was on hand). .38 Special (Alliant Data) Warning! And, oh yeah. ,I looked at Speer data, nothing there. @ Grumpy- I tried LOTS of grips on S&W revolvers. The Pistol a Smith and Wesson model 27-2 The goal is two fold. We look at three classics: one each in .45 ACP, .38 Special, and 9mm. Great Cast Lead Bullet for IDPA. Its the kind of load that will make you fall in love with the 1911 all over again! Save my name, email, and website in this browser for the next time I comment. 3.7gr WST with Zero 158 SWC did the job for me. I have 100% confidence in my ability to shoot quickly, accurately, and comfortably with the 32, and I also have confidence that, if needed, my 32 H&R loads from Buffalo Bore and DoubleTap are quite capable of doing the job they are asked to do. Alliant Pistol/Revolver Load Data: Be Alert: Publisher cannot be responsible for errors in published load data. These types of guns are not as strong as more modern solid frame revolvers. I shoot a Glock 21, and had a great time shooting some poly coated 230 grain round noses today. (Inceptor) Diameter: 0.357" Powder: CFE Pistol (Hodgdon) Primer: WIN WSP Case: WIN Trim Length: 1.145" C.O.L. I love a nice, full-size .357 Magnum on the range because it is so easy to train new shooters on. Enter to win an FN FAL Rifle. I use Bullseye powder but it's about the same burn rate. it seems awful confusing, but with time you will be able to interpolate the published data into something that will give you good starting points to work up your loads. On my J frame S&W without the CT #305 Laser Grips, I swapped out to a Hoque set. No benchrest, nothing but two shakey hands holding the pistol. While I wish I could carry a 5 .45 WITNESS with several 10 round mags, as a senior citizen, the S&W J frame is my user friendly alternate. Im still new to reloading, having done 2500 38 spl with bullseye. Wow I learned something vital from this topic. 4.2 gr. Disclaimer, I own or owned all the super calibers out there except the casull, theyre all fun and quite useful in some scenarios, but dont discount the old timer. I keep it under my seat in case I get an unwanted intruder and I cant get to my IWB semi auto. Softer alloys of lead are just easier on the machinery. These two can cover the entire performance spectrum up to .38+P. I just got some clays which I heard was very clean burning compare to bullseye. Eventually somebody introduced me to tungsten carbide resizing dies, after which case life became near indefinite. Beginners to shooting can use a full size revolver or their carry gun with light to mild loads to become confident and familiar with marksmanship and trigger control. Bullseye, Unique and 2400 are products of Alliant (formerly Hercules) Powders. That isnt unique to Bullseye, but is certainly more pronounced with the relatively small charges required. I SEE THAT YOUR TALKING ABOUT USE THE AMMO FOR D/R. My M60 came w/ factory banana grips- open back, long enough for pinkie rest but too small in girth behind the trigger guard. Groups with these loads ranged from 1.25 inches to just under two inches at 25 yards across a handful of pistols. As you move up in loads, you at least need the gas check on the bottom of the bullet to prevent gas melting the lead and fouling the barrel. Ive been shooting them for 50 years. The .44 spl. Winchesters 231 or WSL are also good powders for the .38 special. Ive been looking for a reason to get into reloading, and am particularly intrigued by the extremely long case life of .38 Special. .38 Special: What Ive Learned After 20,000 Rounds, Stacey Abrams Whopper: No one believes in eroding the Second Amendment, Scottsdale Home Owner Uses Shotgun to Stop Naked Home Invader Caught in His Childs Room [VIDEO], Liberty Ammunitions Innovative Personal Defense Rounds are Lighter, Go Faster, and Hit Harder. SWC+GC, But one classic target load is not far behind the .38 wadcutter in its own reputation with target shooters: a 200-grain semiwadcutter bottling up 4.6 grains of Bullseye. He has taught and been responsible for numerous advanced skills and weapons courses within multiple organizations. If you continue to use this site we will assume that you are happy with it. And I still think a 158 at 600 beats hell out of a 22 magnum of any stripe. It'll look funky, but it will shoot. Does anyone have experience with loading WST for 125 gr plates bullets or a place to start the research/testing? Good thing I didn't go with the original powder charge I intended to use. I have two editions of it from different years that have that data. The fast powders, W231, HP38, Bullseye would go over pressure very quickly with any slight changes, in seating depth or primer change. Swaged bullets do not have the hardness of poured (cast) lead. The mention of a Lee Loader somewhere above took me back to the good-old days. The other .38 Special is a 4 Colt Diamondback. 100 except where otherwise noted in "remarks" Be Alert: Publisher cannot be responsible for errors in published load data. The 919 case is tapered and therefore wider at the base than the .38 special is. The manufacturing process of swaged bullets requires relatively soft lead for two reasons. There really is a recently developed technology that prevents leading, while eliminating messy lubricants. Modern .38 spl std HP load is more than enough, dont over think it. Winchester's 231 or WSL are also good powders for the .38 special. Thanks for the start load Power Pistol will run lower pressures for the same velocity than W-W 231. 148-grain wadcutter brings accuracy that begs the shooter to test their limits. Heck, 38s in a J frame arent fun- theres no way a 327 Mag isnt worse. When I say that theres rarely a wrong way to do it, I really mean it. With the powders you listed I would try Bullseye, 231, and Unique in that order. I estimate that the price for each of the three loads runs between $7 and $8 per box of 50. 10,870. Load cut these cards at five yards out of this Model 15. During my first half century on this planet, my caliber of choice for defense was 45 ACP- but for everything else it was always 38 SPL. I load my 38 target ammo to 3.5 grainsand my self defense 38 to 3.8 grains, when using 158 grain bullets (and Bullseye). Reduce by 10% to establish a starting charge weight. 3.8 gr. Many reloading manuals also list an estimated pressure with a given load. Especially if you reload. Rookie, back in the day when I was reloading I went through a 3 round butt L. Horton special model 24, a 4 24 and a 4 624. Installed some wood boot grips, modified them with grooves at the bottom of each side panel, similar to those on Pach. Ive been loading 158gr FMJ with Titegroup and the only problem Ive had is getting the seating depth right after the die locknut slipped. 2.7 GR WST IS TOO LIGHT FOR THE 50 YD LINE. My hand ached for a week. 358430 (195 grain) round nose bullet that was used in the old 200 grain police loads as there is always interest in these. I'm asking the above questions because I don't want to run too hot of a load, but wasn't sure if it was ok to drop down below 2.8 as far as 2.5. These are light and easy to shoot. These are put into a large hydraulic press and extruded into a continuous coil of wire. Recoil is the good kind that reminds the shooter handguns are serious tools but without eliciting a flinch. Unlike the author, I did *not* keep records, I cant even imagine how many rounds I loaded, almost 100% .357 magnum, since that was all I shot. Prefer to use the CT model 305 laser grips in lieu of S&W grips. Larry Gibson "Deficient observation is merely a form of ignorance and responsible for the many morbid notions and foolish ideas prevailing." Nikola Tesla 01-30-2020, 01:43 PM #9 Mr_Flintstone Boolit Buddy Join Date Jan 2020 Location Winchester only published load for WST in 38 special using lead bullets if you look at the data for the 158 data the start load goes from 3.3 Gr and a max load of 3.7 Gr. I'm going to start with 3.8 grains. I've been reading about this. The flyers tend to be severe. I checked out Alliant's website-no data for flat point with the powders I have, but data for Gold Dot HPs for Bullseye and Unique. I have tried several different grips before finding the one that worked for me. A handgunner using .38 Specials is set for targets, plinking and small game while .357 Mag. Accurate, powder-puff recoil, and serious power all in one. However recoil will be the limiting factor especially for the short line. I believe this particular bullet is meant for the 9mm,but drops at 358. Therefore, your platform yields a lot of safety cushion with target loads. The .38 Special's MAP is 17,000 psi, whereas for the .38 Special +P it is 20,000 psi. Anyway, you are probably right that the revolver guys trend towards the older end of the spectrum, but I think some of the younger guys are starting to catch on to the magic of wheel guns. Be careful about published sources (and doubly so about internet sources), regarding maximum loads for the 38 special. Content . 110gr JHP! .38 brass isnt as common as 9, .40, or .45 brass at the range, but of all the revolver brass you can find its the most plentiful. A cold header, at their basic level, are multi ton power presses laying down on their side. 110gr JHP! Hornady Would you like to react to this message? I tried 10 shots of each: 2.2, 2.4, 2.5, 2.7. 38 special was also my first cartridge to reload, and one of my greatest loves for reloading to this day. I did 400 rounds in one afternoon on my Hornady progressive. Read my very long thread about "DR loads that don't suck". I have read some posts online from people who claim that it makes no difference whether the bullets are swaged or cast; and they can be loaded to the same velocity, but the swaged bullets will lead up a barrel faster because the lead is softer. I will start ouy at the minimum velocity then. My best group was .9 inch out of a Model 15. Ive loaded some wadcutters to the point of being flush with the case mouth and big lead bullets almost to the front of the cylinder. The .38 with careful selection of components can be the cats as* for almost any shooter.
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