John 14:29-31 KJV (29) And now I have told you before it come to About UsContact UsPrayer RequestsPrivacy Policy, Latest AnswersBible LessonsBibleAsk LIVEOnline Bible. For those who believe that Luke 17:34-36 is not speaking of the rapture but of the judgment after Christ's Second Coming and that those taken are the wicked, I must point out a few things and conclude with a determining factor. Two men walking up a hill,/ One disappears and one's left standing still;/ I wish we'd all been ready. other left. Jesus faulted the Pharisees for missing (ignoring) the signs of the times: His own day WAS the "last days"! How do I align things in the following tabular environment? gather., 37 "And answering they *said to Him, Where, Lord? And He said to Again, we learn that the people taken out of the city were the saved. Where will they be taken? Two prophets will be located at Jerusalem and urge the construction of the Temple. . In Luke 17:37 who are taken, who are left behind and where are they taken? In other words, an equally legitimate interpretation of the disciples' question is that the disciples wanted to know where the events Jesus was telling them about would take place. After He has defeated the nations of the world who attempted to annihilate Israel, He will judge everyone who survived Armageddon. them, Wheresoever the body is, thither will the eagles be gathered A non-profit, 501(c)3 corporation. The ones taken were saved and the ones left were the ones destroyed by the flood. The Greek word for left is aphiemi which literally means to send and is used of a man putting away his wife in divorce (1 Corinthians 7:11-13). What phrases give people the false idea that there will be a secret rapture? 0 Was Jesus talking about the rapture or judgment in Luke 17:34-37? (8) And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the These two signs will occur at the same time and will send an unmistakable message to 144,000 Jewish men who will instantly turn to Jesus Christ. I will answer it myself, if no one else has a satisfactory answer, but I would like to keep it open, just in case. Wherever the body is, there the eagles will be gathered together.. me no more; (11) Of judgment, because the prince of this world is gathered together. The literal meaning of the words must agree with the context. Luke 17:30-33(NASB). Jesus said: And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold (Israel): them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one flock (Jew and Gentile in the Church), and one shepherd (Christ the head of the Church) (John 10:16). " I would like to comment on the Lords words in Luke 17:34-37 and Matthew 24:40-41. The word for the bird is generic in both accounts. Two women will be grinding at the mill; one will be taken and one will be left. Clarify Share Report Asked July 23 2021 Jack Gutknecht Answers (3) Therefore the Disciples could not have understood that Jesus might be speaking about the Rapture of the Church. After answering the Pharisees in Luke 17, Jesus said: I tell you, in that night there shall be two in one bed; the one shall be taken, and the other shall be left. And the ones left were the ones destroyed by fire. At the rapture, of course, believers are taken. Any duration. First, I found Matthew 24:28almost verbatim. And he said unto The CEB and the disciple who barely escaped Whenever a new Bible translation comes out, questions arise about changes to familiar passages. When one is taken and the other left Israel will know the end of the age has come. If you se vultures you know where the corpses are. the midst of heaven, Come and gather yourselves together unto the rev2023.3.3.43278. Wherever the body is, there the eagles will be gathered together., The eagles are farsighted birds , spiritually far sighted individuals are likened to eagles and will be taken along "for salvation" and will gather together where the body is," to the Spiritual Wedding Feast prepared by the King - "God." But we cannot assume that the Lord is talking about the same people when He spoke of some who are taken and received to Himself while others are left; put away in judgment. Jesus didnt say it was the Rapture. If the rapture had occurred, then the dead have already risen because Paul . One will be taken and the other left.") Jesus' answer in Luke 17:37 plainly points to judgment. When I compared the accounts of the Flood (Luke 17:26-27, Matthew 24:37-39), I noticed Jesus was talking about the same people wicked people who died in the Flood. Here is Luke 17:30-33, It will be just the same on the day that the Son of Man is revealed. Are kill () and destroy () synonyms? For all this His anger is not turned away, But His hand [is] stretched out still. This is the great judgment/wrath at Christ's Second Coming, when God kills His enemies and instructs scavenger-birds to gather and eat their corpses (Revelation 19:17-21). daughters, which are here; lest thou be consumed in the iniquity of In other words, they will experience the glory and not the gory! 42 Keep awake We must follow Jesus in His footsteps and go away from the congregations of unbelievers in this coming time. If any man hear His Word and believes (rejecting what one hears and does not receive it) not shall be judged by the Word of God that He has spoken. Luke makes allusion to the same people but instead of "taken" (as appears in the NASB of Matthew) Luke mentions the "destruction" of those at the time of the flood (Luke 17:27, NASB). The people "taken" - These are Christians who are tracked down after Christianity is outlawed and arrested. The armies that follow them will likewise be slain. That is, birds of prey visible in the heavens congregate and devour corpses on earth. Real Questions. Pre-Tribulation Rapture also is not true. or 'There!' There will be two women grinding at the same place; one will be taken and the other will be left. (14) And Lot went out, and spake unto his sons Connect and share knowledge within a single location that is structured and easy to search. 22 He said to the disciples, "The days will come when you will yearn to see one of the days of the Son of Man, . The words quoted in Luke 17 come after the Lord had answered the Pharisees question about the timing of the Kingdom of God. You welcome my friend. Luke 17:34-37 ESV - 34 I tell you, in that night there will be two in one bed. I tell you, in that night there shall be two. This answered prayer was what caused me to doubt Pre-Tribulation Rapture, and then I became convinced its impossible. Inded, welcome! "( Matthew 24:38 NRSV, Luke 17:26). Does God expect me to live with a physically abusive spouse. For as in those days before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noah entered the ark, and they did not understand until the flood came and took them all away; so will the coming of the Son of Man be. We are to leave it all behind for His sake and the good news of our salvation that we hear in the Word of Truth spoken to our hearing ears from Heaven above. Then He said to the disciples, "It is impossible that no offenses should come, but woe to him through whom they do come! Enter your email to receive new articles straight to your Inbox, The Herald of Hope To learn more, see our tips on writing great answers. All Rights Reserved. For the coming of the Son of Man will be just like the days of Noah. Moreover, his kingdom will be without end. whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you In one case those left are judged and in the other case those left are blessed! A remnant will survive. For seven months the house of Israel will be burying them, in order to cleanse the land. What was the role of Timothy in the infant church? Luke 17:34 (NIV). They will "weary" themselves to get you to speak evil back so that they are justified in their own eyes. He calls himself , because he saves us by his death, and feeds us by his body, in his Church, Word, and sacraments . Luke 17:33-37 says, "Remember Lot's wife. And he said unto them, Wheresoever the body is, thither will the eagles be gathered together (Luke 17:34-37). And also consider in the next passage the birds of prey where they are doing the devouring and the sequence of events. One will be taken and the other left. I tell you, in that night there shall be two men in one bed; the one shall be taken, and the other shall be left. Points 10 and 11 (Luke 17:34-35) say that "one will be taken and the other left" and this is the Rapture. good; or else make the tree corrupt, and his fruit corrupt: for the 24 answer, and I originally didn't see the Luke 17 answer on CSE. is luke 21:36 talking about the rapture. They did eat, they drank, they married wives, they were given in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark, and the flood came, and destroyed them all. Before the flood, some people were taken and some were left. So how do we interpret the words of Jesus when He said that in one night there would a global disappearance of individuals from bed, the field and at the mill? 2) The Gospels must be interpreted as addressed to Israel and not the Church because a new dispensation of the Church had not begun at the time. Please see, Welcome and thank you for your contribution. This is symbolically represented in two examples. Here is Matthew 24:37-39. Is Matthew 24:30-31 about the rapture or second coming. How to tell which packages are held back due to phased updates. Big difference. Luke 17:34-35, The Fate of the Raptured Posted on Saturday, October 11, 2014 in Bible Commentary | 1 comment I tell you, on that night two people will be in one bed; one will be taken and the other left. Recovering from a blunder I made while emailing a professor. If I can be shown to be wrong from scripture then I will be happy to be corrected. It is quite clear that both scriptures are about the same event and that it is related to the warnings of the end of the age and the Lords return. Luke says, the Flood came and destroyed them all, and Matthew says, the Flood came and took them all away. To be taken was to be destroyed, or die. Why are non-Western countries siding with China in the UN? Then there will be two men in the field; one will be taken and one will be left. Luke 17:35 (NASB). All Sermons Bible Studies Devotionals Prayers. Two men shall be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left.. A lot seems to be happening in a very short scope of time. I like Joseph's answer, which if no other answers turn in will receive my check. I tell you, in that night there will be two men in one bed: the one will be taken and the other will be left. will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but Luke 17 - Duty, Thankfulness and the Kingdom A. Forgiveness, faith and duty. What he appears to be saying is that the "where" of the events of that "great and terrible Day of the Lord" (Malachi 4:5) will be evident by the human carnage taking place all over the earth, and wherever there is human carnage there will be carrion-eating birds (more likely vultures than eagles) feasting on the flesh of human corpses. The words in the Olivet Discourse come after the Lord has given a chronological description of events following this Church age and lasting for the 7 years of the Tribulation, culminating in the glorious return of Christ to the earth to establish His kingdom and to reign on the throne of David. Do new devs get fired if they can't solve a certain bug? 28 "Likewise, just as it was in the days of Lot: they were eating and We are to leave it all behind (all of their church thoughts and ways) and take nothing of them with us so that we follow the Lord in His footsteps and suffer without the camp by the keeping of His sacrifice as they will persecute us for leaving them. Watch therefore: for ye know not what hour your Lord doth come. Luke 17:34-37 (NIV84) 34 "I tell you, on that night two people will be in one bed; one will be taken and the other left. so this is clearly not a case of people being taken up to heaven or anything like that. Two shall be grinding together; the one shall be taken, and the other left. promises to Israel as a people and nation (see next tenet) are not the same as for the Bride of Christ, the Church. When and where does the Goat and Sheep judgment occur? Verse 37 in Luke immediately follows the description of the rapture of believers (verses 34-36). Real Answers. If they are not still on the earth then who is doing the burying? I was less than satisfied with the Matt. So, AFTER the Great Tribulation, Jesus will return like lightning to rapture believers and to destroy sinners. There is no rapture here. At that height the eagles have perfect vision and can see a mouse on the ground and we too will have perfect vision, we will understand how all the way the Lord has led us. John 12:47-49 KJV (47) And if any man hear my words, and believe not, Luke 17:34. Then I saw an angel standing in the sun, and with a loud voice he called to all the birds that fly directly overhead, "Come, gather for the great supper of God, to eat the flesh of kings, the flesh of captains, the flesh of mighty men, the flesh of horses and their riders, and the flesh of all men, both free and slave, both small and great." To subscribe to this RSS feed, copy and paste this URL into your RSS reader. Revelation 19:21 KJV (21) And the remnant were slain with the sword Then there will be two men in the field; one will be taken and one will be left. Jesus' reply clearly indicates judgment. Soma comes from the Greek word sozo meaning I save. ptma G4430 is coprse, caracass. will be taken and one will be left. It is expedient that we go away.following Him out. It doesn't matter if it is a raven or an eagle! Luke 17:30-37 KJV (30) Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son 34 I tell you, on that night two people will be in one bed; one will be taken and the other left. drinking, buying and selling, planting and building, 29 but on the day I will not talk much with you: **for the prince of this world cometh, Recommend reading Luke 17:20-37 for better understanding, the parallel in Matthew below is a slightly different, this is because Jesus repeated many things as he preached from town to town. (12) I have yet many things to say unto you, but ye cannot (Matthew 24:28). The "brightness of His presence" = the keeping of His sacrifice (the Lamb) in our lives in the persecution by not returning evil for their evil. 2) The Great Tribulation at Point 3. I tell you, in that night there shall be two men in one bed; the one shall be taken, and the other shall be left. The ones left are simply non Christians hence people who are of no concern to the Anti-Christ. 04 Mar 2023 00:06:00 Learn more about Stack Overflow the company, and our products. things to come. Here is a blog post that explains it in more detail: https://overcomingthetribulation.com/carcasses-eagles-and-taken/. There is no question about that. It has come to my attention, and as I understand it, that those who insist that the rapture verses of Matthew 24:40-41 and Luke 17:34-36 are, in their opinion, a judgment of the unsaved, are saying that the Greek word "paralambn" - as found in another passage of Scripture - can carry the connotation of judgment. be the coming of the Son of Man. 35 Two women will be grinding grain together; one will be taken and the other left. For more information about this event, we must read Matthew 25:31-46. Matthew 24:40-41 (NASB) Event After the Second Coming of Christ It would be true to say that the Disciples could not have understood Jesus to be referring to the Rapture but to say that Jesus was not speaking of the Rapture is just a wrong exposition. We are to keep His sacrifice in the presence of their persecutions by not returning evil for their evil. The word for eagle occurs 4 times in the New Testament and always from the same Greek word. Again, these fowl in Revelation 19 are the multitude of words of the unbelievers who will not believe in the true sayings of God when the Scriptures are opened up by the Lord to our hearing ears. We know it is the Rapture of the Church because we have Pauls epistles that explain it. Two shall be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left. In Luke I believe that we are seeing the body of Christ (the church) being raptured the be with the Lord in the air where eagles gather. Two women shall be grinding together; the one shall be taken, and the other left. Points 10 and 11 (Luke 17:34-35) say that "one will be taken and the other left" and this is the Rapture. We must be faithful to the context which is Israel in the last days. AUSTRALIA. In both passages Jesus is talking about the end of the age which is the 7 years of Great Tribulation immediately before Jesus comes. The birds come to pluck out their eyes as they eat their carcasses: [Isa 5:25 NKJV] 25 Therefore the anger of the LORD is aroused against His people; He has stretched out His hand against them And stricken them, And the hills trembled. I tell you, in that night there shall be two men in one bed; the one shall be taken, and the other shall be left. Whereas the eagles in Matthew 24:28 gather around carcases, the eagles in Luke 17:37 gather around living bodies. Thus eagles in Luke 17:37 could refer angels. The words taken and left have a literal meaning. Copyright Like The Master Ministries. Those taken or those left behind? After Jesus said, one would be taken and the other left, the disciples asked where they would be left. Considering the context starts several verses earlier, nor will they say, 'Look, here it is!' So what does it mean that "the residue of the people shall not be cut off from the city"? It is true that when the Lord comes after the Tribulation He will judge the ungodly. (36) Two men In the book of Daniel 9:26 it states "The end will come like a flood" Here is a parallel that liken the two ends as similar. Two shall be grinding together; the one shall be taken, and the other left. Luke 17:34 (NASB), I tell you, in that night there will be two men in one bed: the one will be taken and the other will be left. "'" Other Translations for Luke 17:34 I tell you, in that night there shall be two men in one bed; the one shal be taken, the other shall be left. I believe that Luke 17 has the rapture in mind and the verse in question should read where the body is, there the eagles will gather. The word is body in Luke and corpse in Matt 24. This chart shows the flow of events as: 1) The Antichrist at Point 1. There are two things that must agree in the interpretation of any passage of Scripture. the Father which sent me, he gave me a commandment, what I should say, Most Popular. Genesis 19:9-15 KJV (9) And they said, Stand back. They will want you to return evil for their evil when they speak against you for receiving it. "For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord" (1 Thessalonians 4:16, 17). The Holy Spirit chose the words of Scripture and any interpretation must faithfully interpret those words in their literal meaning. The Lord will not destroy the righteous with the wicked.so we must depart and follow Jesus out. Two women shall be grinding together; the one, Ellicott's Commentary for English Readers. of man is revealed. (Matthew 24:40-42). In this passage, Jesus is referring to those who would be taken, and those who would be "Left Behind". Luke 17:34-35.But the decision at the Parousia, what a separation it will be!a separation of those who are in the temporal life united in a perfectly common position. Luke 17:34 and Matthew 24:40 both describe events that will occur at the Goat and Sheep Judgment. Russia will invade with her Islamic associates; two thirds of the Jews in the land will perish; but Israel will cry out to Jesus Christ and the invaders will be destroyed. The words in question are very similar in both passages: Then shall two be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left. Two men shall be in the field; the one shall be taken, and. What Is the Difference Between 'Man' And 'Son of Man' in Num 23:19? and what I should speak. They will seek to prevent others in believing the revealed Word of Truth and will persecute those who will receive it in faith. Next, Jesus said once again one will be taken and one left. And they answered and said unto him, Where, Lord? destroyed all of them 30 it will be like that on the day that the Son mouth: and all the fowls were filled with their flesh. And Noah and Lot are used as examples of those left behind and surviving destruction; Noah survived the flood but everyone else was destroyed and Lot survived the fiery brimstone but everyone else was destroyed. desolation is near. judge him in the last day. Biblical Hermeneutics Stack Exchange is a question and answer site for professors, theologians, and those interested in exegetical analysis of biblical texts. This is the correct interpretation of one taken and the other left. " This is a picture* of angels that are in the process of transporting from earth newly departed peoples' souls, through the legendary dark tunnel, to the heavenly light in the far distance. Every idle word that men shall speak, they shall give an account thereof in the Day of Judgment. In Luke 17:28-33 what does Jesus mean by "save his life" and "lose his life"? They will also be tormented in the presence of the holy angels.the messengers.the words of our Lord which are life and spirit. Each Book adds a little more detail to the questions His Disciples asked of Jesus about His coming Kingdom "when . Now lets read the verses you are referring to in (Luke 3436): I tell you, in that night there shall be two men in one bed; the one shall be taken, and the other left. I tell you, on that night two people will be in one bed: One will be taken and the other left. This is because the dead have already risen by Luke 17:37. I believe that the context in Luke is about not being like Lots wife an having one foot in the kingdom and one foot still back in Sodom , you will be left for destruction.